1 I would like to thank Joanna Jurewicz for reading the manuscript and for her Text Society: “Playing with Fire: the pratītyasamutpāda from the Perspective of. The arguments are based on articles by Joanna Jurewicz, which unfortunately I can’t easily access right now, such as “Playing with fire: the. Elsewhere Joanna Jurewicz has attempted to show that the choice of terms for the .. „Playing with Fire: Pratītyasamutpāda from the perspective of Vedic.

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The Buddha, of course, was rejecting the idea of the atman and the denial of the atman makes the Vedic cosmogony meaningless. As for the specific link formulation, – it’s just one of the way in which Buddha expressed the Conditioned Arising model.

In fact, the good venerable arguably gives more time to expounding on these 4 nidanas than he does the rest of the sequence! A volitional impulse kama – desire initiates the process of creation. And, I might add, irony does not weather well. This corresponds to ignorance. No registered users and 4 guests.

Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. This much is consonant with the received tradition.

The primary metaphor for consciousness in the Vedic joxnna is fire, hence the Buddha framed his understanding of consciousness in similar terms. It would not be so surprising considering how much Buddhist doctrine is a reworking of preexisting ujrewicz. However, it’s hard to do justice to it without typing out several pages of the book Phassa contact ; 7.


What he means by “on fire” is that we our experience is burning with desire, with hatred, and with spiritual ignorance. The Vedic religion was one in which fire played a central role. In brief, the argument is that the step chain is the result of pasting together two chains, and that the first four links are a parody of Vedic Cosmogony.

Jayarava’s Raves: Playing with Fire

Upadana ujrewicz ; Newer Post Older Post Home. Jati birth ; The 12 links are one of those things with jurwwicz many varied interpretations, the more context we have the better off we’ll be. Fire was very much part of the religious imagination of India by the time of the Buddha, and Gombrich argues that it is from this source that the Buddha draws for his fire metaphor.

The thing that struck me was that Gombrich and Ven N. Nama-rupa name-and-form ; 5.

Actually, maybe that list was one Mike sourced from somewhere rather than Gombrich’s text – it’s not quite clear. Following a psychological interpretation, the contradictions Joanja is speculating about do not arise.

Dependent Origination and the Vedas – Dhamma Wheel

This is important for contemporary Buddhists. What Professor Gombrich has shown on more than one occasion is that the received tradition is confused on some points of doctrine or linguistics. In this view clinging would be fuel for becoming, and in my opinion this works much better as an explanation of process. There are many other suttas with quite different formulations, which wait for serious study, for example:.

Dhamma Wheel

Sankhara mental fabrications ; 3. Bhava becoming ; God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. I’m not qualified to comment on the alleged Vedic parody entailed within the first 4 nidanas, but whether it is so or not, there’s a lot of deep Dhammic content entailed within the first 4, as exhibited through the teachings of venerable Nanananda. I have been re-reading the notes from those lectures and wanted to highlight lecture seven which discussed the use of fire as a metaphor by the Buddha.


Then, at another point, the Buddha produced a different causal chain to ironize and criticise Vedic cosmogony, and noticed that it led very nicely into the earlier chain – jurewkcz because it is natural for the creation of the jownna to lead straight on to the six senses, and these, via ‘contact’ and ‘feeling’, to thirst. In the Rig Veda: There is more hope for a fool than for him.

The purpose of this post was essentially to say that whether Gombrich’s theory is true or not, we’re better off not just clipping off the first four nidanas as some kind of antiquated irrelevancy.

Thich Nhat Hanh “The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees.

As for the rest of Gombrich’s speculations, they are based in a reincarnation interpretation of Dependent Origination rather than a psychological interpretation. Anyone familiar with the discourses of the Buddha will most likely have clocked that the Buddha uses fire as a metaphor in several different ways.